SFFWorld's Favorite 2012 Book (should be no surprise)

[Rob B]

So discussion is going on; it's just we are the home of the unofficial Joe Abercrombie fan club, which just sort of happened, and the Steve Erikson club is still fairly strong, and many wait for George and enjoy the t.v. show meanwhile. Whereas our China Mieville fan club (Railsea,) Robin Hobb fan club (City of Dragons just came out this year so she missed the deadline,) and Jim Butcher fan club (Cold Days -- our contemporary fantasy one) have somewhat declined.

There are worse things to be called than the "unofficial Joe Abercrombie fan club, one could say.

Nice post Kat, well said.

With regards to Joe's overwhelming win, that was indeed expected.
Just want to point out that this is also due to the fact that there were no major 2012 releases from GRRM, Sanderson, Rothfuss and Bakker.
All 4 of these have either won or given close competition in the past 10 years.

Indeed, though I think Abercrombie may have garnered top with any of those four save for GRRM

In addition, Robin Hobb and Steven Erikson are also past winners of the SFFworld Year's Best Award as I recall, but their popularity has waned somewhat over the years. Hobb's Fitz narrated books were winners or in the top 3 every year IIRC, back in the early 00's she was the top dog here. Erikson's last couple of books have been received less enthusiastically, I think as of Toll the Hounds his popularity here and on Westeros has gone down.

I haven't read Hobb's latest Rain Wilds novels, but my complete and total frustration, anger, and disappointment with Soldier Son has me very wary to try anything else by her since.

 

[AmethystOrator]

I now realize how important pre-orders and "first week purchases" are...when self-published we don't have such notions. Peter (Brett) made the USA Today bestseller list because of good sales his release week and he made the "extended list" for the New York Times. I can't deny that hitting such a list is a goal I would love to reach someday, but much of the strength of my sales are that, like the Energizer Bunny, they just keep going. I don't look at sales...but my wife who does...keeps me informed.

It seems a shame that there is so much emphasis on initial sales, and I know that it occurs in other entertainment media as well such as at the movies, with DVD/BR releases and video games too. Though I understand why the sales models have evolved that way, especially so in our current age where there is so much advertising and hype that briskly moves from one "it" thing to the next. Still, I look at steady and consistent sales, such as you speak of and has been seen with a few other notable properties such as the TV show Firefly, as hopefully an indicator that you've had strong recommendations and word of mouth that will perhaps translate into more pre-orders and first week buyers for your releases this year.

By the time the books come out I've usually written a few more and am deep into my current WIP so in some ways they are pretty much off my radar as I finished them over a year before. So no, having the release dates being the same won't distract, although I'm usually pretty subdued on the birthday front too.

That sounds like a positive attitude and I'm glad that the release date won't be a negative.

It also sounds plausible that you've written at least a book or two that follow those we're already aware of. Not that I'd ask you to confirm such a thing, but I do hope that whatever you've been doing it is going well.

 

[AmethystOrator]

I haven't read Abercrombie's newest myself, though that's entirely due to the fact that the U.S. edition imho looks like #@"%, whereas the one across the pond is eminently beautiful and distinguished and graceful and glorious. I need to get around to ordering from Amazon UK, I just hate that the shipping fees are so high (and I'm not really a fan of bookdepository in case anyone were helpful enough to suggest them).

I wonder if anyone else hasn't yet read Red Country due to the cover?

 

[Haliax]

The discussion around female authors is interesting to me. The gender of the author doesn't really affect my decision in what I'm going to read next at all, yet I do still end up reading a lot more male written books than female. In my last ~70 books read, only 10 of them were written by female authors. And of those 10, 5 were from by K.J. Parker. Since I've started keeping track, I've only read 28 books written by female authors, of about 140 books read. And of those 28, only 7 of them did I rate above my average score of 7.8/10 (I'm pretty generous in my scores, but doesn't really matter since it is only for my reference anyways). Small sample size, but eh... still thought it was interesting.

 

[Loerwyn]

The discussion around female authors is interesting to me. The gender of the author doesn't really affect my decision in what I'm going to read next at all, yet I do still end up reading a lot more male written books than female. In my last ~70 books read, only 10 of them were written by female authors. And of those 10, 5 were from by K.J. Parker. Since I've started keeping track, I've only read 28 books written by female authors, of about 140 books read. And of those 28, only 7 of them did I rate above my average score of 7.8/10 (I'm pretty generous in my scores, but doesn't really matter since it is only for my reference anyways). Small sample size, but eh... still thought it was interesting.

K.J. Parker isn't a "female author". Their gender is purposefully kept ambiguous, so much so that I think only a tiny, tiny number of people actually know.

 

[Andor]

I haven't read Hobb's latest Rain Wilds novels, but my complete and total frustration, anger, and disappointment with Soldier Son has me very wary to try anything else by her since.

I have yet to read Soldiers Son or rain wilds, strange because I would consider Hobb as my favourite author.. I just really dont like dragons, enjoyed the Liveships but wasn't a fan of the rain wild chapters. Should really look at them next, maybe she has managed to create another Fool, Chade or Burrich in there somewhere.

 

[sullivan_riyria]

Our Mr. Sullivan is an interesting case. When he came here, he ventured that he was writing somewhat comic adventure fantasy of the sort nobody did anymore. And of course, he was wrong. Lots of authors do it, many of which we've discussed here, though I never did manage that whole list for him. But Sullivan's work is also plenty dark (I'm working on the second compilation at the moment,) and it is also less caper than battle fantasy. It is about clashing kingdoms, various types of battles, spy skullduggery, crows pecking eyes, etc. He has much in common with Mr. Lynch and a number of other current authors, he has antecedents of Mr. Kay and more than a touch of descent from Mr. Cook et. al., both Garrett and Black Company. So he fits right in.

Interesting...I read Lynch and Cook after writing my series, (and haven't read any Kay yet), but I don't see similarities at all. I think for me I see a plethora of anti-heroes.Defined by Wikipedia as: a protagonist who has no heroic virtues or qualities (such as being morally good, idealistic, courageous, noble, and possessing fortitude). While Royce, Hadrian, Arista, and Thrace/Modina certainly are not all shiny and invincible they are indeed "heroes" and it is that which I miss most in recent works. So, yes Kat...I'm still waiting for the list - but I know you are busy (as am I) so whenever you can get to it I'll dig in.

 

[Haliax]

K.J. Parker isn't a "female author". Their gender is purposefully kept ambiguous, so much so that I think only a tiny, tiny number of people actually know.

I realize that. Which is why I mentioned that 5 of those books were by "her". The only reason I even included them was because there is a wider belief that Parker is a woman than there is that Parker is a man.

 

[Luke_B]

Congratulations, Joe -- another good result you will be able to use to plug your work on your blog in between whiskey duels.

Every year this poll lacks diversity and every year one or more people comment on the fact. I long ago accepted it as universal truth that the majority of SFFWorld forum users dig epic battle fantasy (to borrow Kat's terminology) written by men. I let them go about their business and they let me go about mine.

However, there is also a minority, albeit a significant minority, of people that post on these forums that read across genres and authors with different backgrounds. Generally, they're the people whose tastes I share, whose opinions I find interesting, and whose recommendations I follow.

Having said that, looking at my past reading habits, I think I've let myself down by not reading enough books by women. One of my new year's resolutions it to start alternating between books by male and female writers. I'm not saying everybody should do this and if you only want read epic battle fantasy by men, then good for you. I like that genre too, and Joe Abercrombie is one of my favourite authors. But I want to read other stuff too, I want to be a reader who reads widely, and enjoy the full spectrum that SFF has to offer.

Indecently, none of the books I voted for made the top ten, though I have read about half of Red Country and enjoyed it a good deal, so far.

 

[KatG]

1.A Dance with Dragons by George R. R. Martin (116 total points)
2.The Heroes by Joe Abercrombie (92 total points)
3.The Wise Man’s Fear by Patrick Rothfuss (76 total points)
4.The Crippled God by Steven Erikson (66 points)
5.The White Luck Warrior by R. Scott Bakker (46 points)
6.Leviathan Wakes by James S.A. Corey (40 points)
7.Ready Player One by Ernest Cline (36.5 points)
8.The Iron Jackal by Chris Wooding (32 points)
9.The Dragon’s Path by Daniel Abraham (27 points)
10.Among Others by Jo Walton (21 Points)

And Corey's SF novel is a military SF novel. Ready Player One is in a fighting video game situation so edges it. So Jo was the lone female and one of the few non-battle books. Wooding's Iron Jackal is also not a battle epic, I think. On the up side, knowing what battle epics and military works those who read a lot of them think are the best doesn't hurt.

It seems a shame that there is so much emphasis on initial sales,

In fiction publishing, it's a mix. Initial sales are important, especially to the big booksellers who are all using BookScan. But publishers make most of their money off the backlist and there are numerous top sellers who have sold millions of copies but never made the top bestseller lists, or who did, but did the bulk of their sales after that. Books stay around a lot longer than other forms of entertainment if they keep selling. So fiction publishers are after good initial sales and longevity as well. Most bestsellers are slow burn bestsellers -- they get on the lists some three-six books into an author's career or series after an audience has built up and done word of mouth.

yet I do still end up reading a lot more male written books than female.

We were talking about this over at Jim Hines' blog recently. Male is the default setting. We're so used to, male or female, reading male writers and male pov, that we tend to be drawn to it unconsciously, regard it as less alien, assess it with different standards, and women authors also can have a harder time getting review, media and general fan attention thereby. But there are female authors like Robin Hobb, Elizabeth Moon, etc. who are well liked here.

I read Lynch and Cook after writing my series, (and haven't read any Kay yet), but I don't see similarities at all. I think for me I see a plethora of anti-heroes.Defined by Wikipedia as: a protagonist who has no heroic virtues or qualities (such as being morally good, idealistic, courageous, noble, and possessing fortitude). While Royce, Hadrian, Arista, and Thrace/Modina certainly are not all shiny and invincible they are indeed "heroes" and it is that which I miss most in recent works. So, yes Kat...I'm still waiting for the list - but I know you are busy (as am I) so whenever you can get to it I'll dig in.

This made me laugh. We'll take it up in your thread after I finish Book 4 about how your thief/assassin/mercenary/spy/blackmailers are more honorable than Cook's mercenaries and Lynch's thieves. Maybe we'll even make it a thread about rogues. But, nonetheless, your series is about a series of wars/battles in epic proportions with spying, etc., in a secondary world. So you fit within the subset.

 

[Loerwyn]

And Corey's SF novel is a military SF novel. Ready Player One is in a fighting video game situation so edges it. So Jo was the lone female and one of the few non-battle books. Wooding's Iron Jackal is also not a battle epic, I think. On the up side, knowing what battle epics and military works those who read a lot of them think are the best doesn't hurt.

I don't think it was military SF. There were M-SF elements there, certainly (and more so in the second), but for the most part it was more an investigation novel, so I think most would class it as space opera.

 

[Skynjay]

Having said that, looking at my past reading habits, I think I've let myself down by not reading enough books by women. One of my new year's resolutions it to start alternating between books by male and female writers. I'm not saying everybody should do this and if you only want read epic battle fantasy by men, then good for you. I like that genre too, and Joe Abercrombie is one of my favourite authors. But I want to read other stuff too, I want to be a reader who reads widely, and enjoy the full spectrum that SFF has to offer.

After a similar discussion on another forum I also started this. Not in an every-other book role, but trying to hit at least a 50/50 split over a month. I assure you, it has been nothing but rewarding, and forced me off the front shelves at the bookstore, and into the depths. Though I should have known better, when I started I was fairly amazed at how many women were writing non-UF fantasy. They just are not getting the same press.

Of course the downside is my to-read list is now twice as long, and I always have about eight choices for what is next.

 

[Rob B]

I don't think it was military SF. There were M-SF elements there, certainly (and more so in the second), but for the most part it was more an investigation novel, so I think most would class it as space opera.

Agree, the authors have basically said this series is their love letter to old school space opera. Granted, many space opera novels have military elements in them, but The Expanse is solar system space opera.

 

[sullivan_riyria]

This made me laugh. We'll take it up in your thread after I finish Book 4 about how your thief/assassin/mercenary/spy/blackmailers are more honorable than Cook's mercenaries and Lynch's thieves. Maybe we'll even make it a thread about rogues. But, nonetheless, your series is about a series of wars/battles in epic proportions with spying, etc., in a secondary world. So you fit within the subset.

Let's talk after book 6 ;-) At the end of book 4 you are still missing too many pieces of the larger thread. I think it's just plain "good writing" to have "gray" in characters so my characters aren't all shiny polished armor - okay well one or two are, but the majority of them are on a journey to put their past behind them and are generally "doing the right thing." That in my book is heroic what their profession is isn't what makes them an anti-hero...it's what they are motivated by.

As for my books being in a secondary world with wars/battles/spying - we are not in any disagreement and I've never made any comments to the contrary on that front.

 

[ArtNJ]

And Corey's SF novel is a military SF novel. Ready Player One is in a fighting video game situation so edges it. So Jo was the lone female and one of the few non-battle books. Wooding's Iron Jackal is also not a battle epic, I think. On the up side, knowing what battle epics and military works those who read a lot of them think are the best doesn't hurt.

This strikes me as incredibly dismissive and wrong, just as if you had said these novels are "boy stuff" -- which doesnt seem too far from what you are doing.

Corey's novel is about complex events set in a vividly realized future society. Conflict is secondary to the plot, and flows entirely from the circumstances. Nor is there much of it. There is a lot more solving the mystery, and adventure as the winds of fait carry the protagonists across the solar system.
If this is "military sci-fi" than basically any story that features any weapons or violence in any context is military sci-fi.

Ready Player One is homage to all video game culture, including pong. It is not a "fighting video game situation".

If you want a book without any sort of violence in at all, thats fine, but dont exagerate/twist to make a point.

 

[Haliax]

And Corey's SF novel is a military SF novel. Ready Player One is in a fighting video game situation so edges it. So Jo was the lone female and one of the few non-battle books. Wooding's Iron Jackal is also not a battle epic, I think. On the up side, knowing what battle epics and military works those who read a lot of them think are the best doesn't hurt.

I don't really think that Wise Man's Fear is a battle epic either, is it?

We were talking about this over at Jim Hines' blog recently. Male is the default setting. We're so used to, male or female, reading male writers and male pov, that we tend to be drawn to it unconsciously, regard it as less alien, assess it with different standards, and women authors also can have a harder time getting review, media and general fan attention thereby. But there are female authors like Robin Hobb, Elizabeth Moon, etc. who are well liked here.

I think it more likely that in my case it is that most of the books I read are ones that I hear about on this forum. Since I started posting here, I've actually read less and less from female authors. I think in the future I will make an attempt to be more diverse in my reading habits, as Luke B has suggested.

 

[AmethystOrator]

I would have to read more male authors in order to achieve a 50/50 split.

 

[Haliax]

I would have to read more male authors in order to achieve a 50/50 split.

Then perhaps you can recommend some female authors for me.

 

[KatG]

I don't think it was military SF. There were M-SF elements there, certainly (and more so in the second), but for the most part it was more an investigation novel, so I think most would class it as space opera.

1) It's getting marketed and talked about as military SF. Every time I'm digging into military SF titles, it pops up on people's lists and they're calling it that. The second title is called Caliban's War and the series is about brewing wars, on-going wars and war-torn space colonies, so I don't think the war part is missing there.

2) Space opera is epic with interplanetary political, military and adventure events. Weber's Honor Harrington series is space opera and military -- they are not mutually exclusive. The big space operas that involve wars are related to the battle epics of fantasy, although they are certainly not the same things.

But my point was not to say that Corey's books are just like Joe Abercrombie's, only that they are comfortably in the neighborhood. Corey's series isn't a quiet tale of robots wondering if they are human or time travel gone wrong. (Not that people in the forums don't like that sort of thing either.)

This strikes me as incredibly dismissive and wrong

It's only dismissive if you think that I consider battle fiction to be dismissed and lesser. I certainly don't. I'm unofficially the secretary of the unofficial Joe Abercrombie fan club here. And when I said that half tended to avoid female written works, I wasn't saying that half was all men. There are quite a few female members here who avoid them too, because that's their choice, and there are lots and lots of female members here who read battle epics, military SF, etc. There is a definite preference on these forums among a large faction of vocal participants for really liking battle epics, though not exclusively. That's neither good nor bad and it's very much in keeping with the larger fantasy field in which battle epics have always been popular. The top ten choices for the last few years have thus heavily favored battle epic fantasies and other books that do often involve big battle stories. That's not the only type that gets on, but it's predominant, and as we've seen here, I'm not the only one to notice it. I'm sorry if you don't think battle stories can be complex and have depth; that's a view that I've clearly disagreed with in the past.

Ready Player One is homage to all video game culture, including pong. It is not a "fighting video game situation".

The hero has to battle corporate gangsters through various game universes to find his golden ticket. I'll agree to rephrase it as a cyberpunk video game adventure thriller, however. But video games do primarily involve battles and the VR universe of the story is indeed filled with battles, such as "where spell-slinging mages battle giant Japanese robots, entire planets are inspired by Blade Runner," etc. The hero has an X-Wing fighter. The climax of the story is a battle of giant robots. So again, it's not a battle epic fantasy. But it is comfortably in the neighborhood for those who like battle epic fantasy. And again, that does not happen to be an assertion that the novel is not soulful, complex, etc.

I don't really think that Wise Man's Fear is a battle epic either, is it?

LOL, no, though the series is headed there. They just really, really like that trilogy, which is a homage and satire of epic fantasy, including big battle coming of age fantasy fiction. It's not like they are only allowed to like the battle epics. They just tend to like a lot of them, and so we see that reflected in the Top Ten list of favorites.

I think it more likely that in my case it is that most of the books I read are ones that I hear about on this forum. Since I started posting here, I've actually read less and less from female authors.

Well, we'll work on that, maybe. If I can get past the first quarter from hell, I'm hoping to talk about more books.

Let's talk after book 6 ;-)

I never said that they weren't honorable, just that I think you're underplaying the honorability of Cook and Lynch's characters with similar backgrounds to yours, and missing the larger picture of fantasy rogue fiction in general. We'll chat in your threads. (For those interested, Sullivan kills at dialogue, IMO.)

 

[AmethystOrator]

Then perhaps you can recommend some female authors for me.

Sure. I actually just did a brief write-up of a couple of female writers in the Reading in March thread, though I didn't love either of the authors as much as some, I thought that both were solid. Can you tell me anything about possible preferences, like traditional fantasy or Urban fantasy or both? Large cast of characters/pov's or more limited?